In the end, I pushed my drive a bit and ended up on the 15th fairway, which gave me an even better line in. But the fun part of the whole process was the standing on the tee and working it out. Don't get me wrong though.
I'm not anti-rough necessarily. Rough like we have here this week gives the talented player a chance to recover. Which is great and as it should be.
The recovery shot might be the most exciting thing to watch at this level. But it disappears completely when the set up is overly penal. When that is the case, there is no point in being good at recovery shots; you'll never get to try one.
The obsession among the various tours around the world seems to be the score we shoot relative to par. We need to forget about par. Would a Wimbledon final be better if the net was higher? Or would the British Grand Prix be more exciting if you narrowed the track and everyone has to drive slower?
I don't think so. Yet again, I think of St Andrews. Two years ago we played the Open there and something like 18 under par won. Did anyone think that demeaned the golf course? The scores we shoot have no relevance to the quality of a golf course. Look also at the 69 Tiger Woods shot in the third round of the US Open at what was almost a rough-covered Oakmont last month. We had the best golfer in the world - one of the two best ever - playing close to his best and he could manage only one under par?
All that proves is that there is something wrong with the course. Happily, none of the above has been the case here at Carnoustie, even if I did miss the cut. Take a close look at the way this great links has been set up this week. This is the way your own course should be presented for the club championship. The rough is an annoyance but not the end of the world.
You have to hit two good shots on any hole to make a birdie. The greens are running at a speed where you can put the pin in almost any spot on almost every green. It has been a fascinating test. Mystic Rocks where the 84 Lumber classic was last year has a Yd par 5 Number Great hole. Vijay carried in two over water and to an unjulated green. Why his drive was center cut. Should he be able to reach in rough no.
Accuracy is what is being proprosed her. Just as in the distance versus the ball striking tread. You place 3 cuts of rough inch, 4 inch, inches around a golf course and watch scores decrease. No need for an 8, yd golf course. Steve Stricker is a ball striker and one of the best on Tour. You need to express this golf course architecture. Even a yard par 5 is reachable in 3 good shots by a guy that hits driver Few if any Pro's can't hit the ball Make the firways wide, the rough deep, the greens fast and make it longer than any course on the planet.
I'm so sick of hearing how courses have to be lengthened to test pros. Grow the rough, tighten the fairways at , furrow the bunkers, and while you're at it make the sand inconsistent so its not perfect nothing I hate more then hearing a pro yell at a ball to "go in the bunker" and tuck the pins, come to think of it slow the greens down too It kinda tweaks me that I see more and more y par 4s from white and blue tees.
I played a course on Monday that had a y par three from the regular tees , surrounded by bunkers and into a prevailing wind. I got on the green with my best hybrid shot ever. The caddie mentioned to our group that fewer than 1 in 10 golfers get on that green from those tees. Our outing included 16 guys, half of whom play in the 70s. Only two of us got on the green.
Sounds like a fun course to me. I just hate all these - yard par 4's where I am forced to not play a driver and have to play an iron off the tee just to leave myself a full swing with a lob wedge. Case in point was Angus Glen, sight of the recent Canadian Open. On two of the par 5's I went driver 7 iron. So what? If the new rules are adopted, it will be interesting to see which of the various tournament committees will implement them- the pro tours and USGA tournaments and qualifiers are a given but state am's, county am's, club championships - maybe championship flight only , high-school matches?
If I'm not mistaken the proposed rules wouldn't just apply to the zip, spin-milled, y-cutter, Mac-daddy grooved wedges but most square or U-grooved iron sets produced in the past 10 years would be non-conforming as well.
Adams D Personally, I like to see the low scores. You guys, and myself cannot shoot 6 under in a round. And from their tees most of us myself included again would be lucky to break Why punish them for being the best, the competition is still good. There are usually few shots between winning and coming in 2nd. Also look at Carnoustie and all of the good players who missed the cut. Some of my favorite golf to watch was the 97 masters, and any tournament where someone is on fire and makes everthing.
I like having somone to pull for. If you make par 4's require long iron approach shots you can forget about the excitement of seeing a wedge shot back up to 3 in. What is more exciting than that. Do you not think that those accurate short iron and wedge shots require an equal amount of skill and refinement that a 4 iron that lands 15 feet away does? I dont know, I just think that there is not a such thing as a golf course that is too easy within reason as long as someone wins and someone loses.
When they all shoot shots under on 18 then I might think differently about it. For me it is competition against eachother, not against the course. Yes, its true that many of the standard grooves will be non-conforming, but the only people who will need to buy new clubs just to conform before their old ones wear out are tour pros.
Most of us will be able to use our current irons and wedges until the grooves are worn out anyways. I also agree with mcputter, the USGA doesnt really need to try to squash every trend that comes into the game, this stuff comes and goes, courses will start to change, and with them the way in which they are played. No I agree I DO like to see low scores every once in a while, I used to love watching Sunday at the Masters and some of the tournaments where you see guys firing at the flag all day long from everywhere.
But theres also something to say when you can force the pros to play the game that I aspire to, fairways, center of the green, 2 putts for par.
I think some of that has been removed with the bunkers being immaculate, the greens rolling like linoleum floors, and the fairways manicured perfectly. I don't doubt that these guys and girls are great at what they do, because they are. The changes they are proposing to the grooves are darn near microscopic. It will get to the point where people will start accusing people of using "illegal grooves. The USGA has its head so far implanted up its posterior its surprising they haven't suffocated themselves yet.
Totally out of touch with golfers and reality in general. A yard par 5 with a wide fairway makes it more of a bombers game than it already is. It accomplishes nothing other than helping the long hitters. You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
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By iacas , August 30, in Welcome, Everyone. By woodzie , February 28, in Member Swings. By iacas , January 6 in The Grill Room. Welcome to TST! Signing up is free , and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! Become a Supporter! Fewer ads and other nice perks! Share More sharing options Followers 0. Reply to this topic Start new topic Note: This thread is days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant.
If not, please start a new topic. Thank you! Recommended Posts. January 18, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options Awards, Achievements, and Accolades. WUTiger January 18, LuciusWooding January 18, Hardballs January 19, January 19, I wouldn't worry too much about these non conforming zip grooves unless your pro, I have the cg16's with DSG, and they're great!
I was informed they're still allowed in amateur club comps for years to come, and wedges won't last 10 years anyway, so just get what works best for you and leave all that serious stuff to the serious people! When the Vokeys are new, they spin way too much and it can take a month or two to wear down the grooves a little. I was expecting at least as much spin from the CG12s as a worn-down Spin Milled wedge provides, but was still disappointed.
This compared poorly to the 15 to 18 feet I averaged with my Vokey. In side-by-side testing with the CG10 and the s, the Zip Grooves on the CG12 did perform slightly better from the rough — balls would stop a few feet shorter than they would off the older wedges.
With anything less than a full swing, performance was nearly identical. While the change did require a different approach from tight lies, the extra bounce did come in handy — as extra bounce should — from fluffy lies in the rough, soft sand, and wet fairway conditions.
Once I adjusted to the lack of spin or check, it became quite easy to control distance, and the clubs responded incredibly well to my attempts at hitting balls at varying heights. It gets dirty quickly and is tough to clean. Others seem to agree in this forum thread disclosure: I started the thread.
Specifications The CG12 are available in both chrome and black pearl. The wedges are all Better players may only get to use them for about a year. The Zip Grooves are pretty heavily marketed. Unfortunately, I feel I could have left this sticker on and gotten just about as much spin. That being said, the CG12 wedges offer several advantages. Nice review, Erik! I picked up a 52 about 6 weeks ago and really enjoy it.
I might get 1 foot of rollout…. Nice review. I was honestly expecting you to tell me how you could not keep your shots on the green becuase they spun back so fast.
Clearly not the case. I suppose the next evolution of the Cleveland wedge will be the DSG sole grind coupled with these grooves? We will see. I was expecting the same as the others said. I thought the clubs would be spinning off the greens. His handicap is about 4 and he can stop the ball on a dime with the cg12 but like you said in you review it does not spin back.
Excellent review! You, my man, should work for Golf Digest. An excellent review from someone that clearly knows what they are talking about. You have convinced me to buy the Spin-Milled Titleist.
I thought that these would challenge the vokey spin milled but obviously not, clearly a very knowledgeable guy and fair when it comes to judging a piece of equipment. First of all, great review. I would think that the emphasis still has to be on feel and ball placement. My preference is on feel, which leads to better ball placement. I had to completely rethink most of my approach shots.
Good questions and thoughts. First off, I think spin is important in two ways. One is on short shots around the green — pitches and chips and that sort. Sometimes you want them to check and grab. Second, spin is an added dimension as well on the fuller shots. For example, on greens with a backstop, I sometimes like to throw the ball behind the hole, and using both spin and the backstop, pull the ball back to the pin.
Throwing the ball to the middle of a green and sucking it back to a front pin is a valuable shot sometimes. The only downside to A is that you have to practice a little more. First, thanks for your fantastic reviews. However, i can say, the bloody thing works. I was actually very concerned, based on the marketing, that the spin would be too excessive. The greens i hit were soft, thus the ball only backed up from the impact point…rather than bouncing PAST the impact point, then rolling backward.
It netted out at about a foot reversal, at most. So the spin was relatively neutral, but the thing i really appreciated where the weight, balance and touch. I just had terrific confidence using the club. I felt like i could toss darts right at the flag and trust it. One last point: sound. I read on a review from Golf.
That is a perfect description. I love the club. Look how tiger hits his full wedge shots these days.. What the wedges and these grooves do for you is allow you to control spin better from the rough, where you really need it. These new wedges have the same spin action that I expect as the version.
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